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Joints Account , Nomination or Will – Which one to use ?

by Manish Chauhan · 124 comments

There are 3 ways one can pass on his wealth to someone – joint accounts, nomination and Will. A lot of people do not know which one is more powerful than other and when to use which one. Today lets discuss few points about joint accounts, nominations and will and some scenarios which will make them clear. Also below is a good video on Wills in case you want to watch.

3 mistakes which investors make

1. Not understanding what a joint account means

If you want to make sure that after your death, your wife operates the account and should be the sole owner of the account then don’t just make her the nominee, better make her a joint account holder in the bank account itself. If you choose “either or survivor” mode, she will be able to transact and do things along with you. But if you want to make sure that she can only operate and take charge once you are not around, then choose “former or survivor” mode, so she will not be able to transact and own anything till you are alive, but once you are no more, she just becomes the owner, without any hassles. This is a better way to give control to someone after your death and more powerful and simple than making a WILL or leaving it on the mercy of fate. You can make some person joint holder in bank accounts, mutual funds, FD’s or real estate properties.

2. Forgetting about old joint holders

A lot of people have joint accounts with their father, mother, brother etc etc years back, but now they want to pass on their wealth to their children/wife on their death, so they put their names in Nominee and also write a WILL (for full proof documentation), but once they die, the nomination and WILL be of no use, because the bank account is not dormant, it’s still alive with a legitimate owner and that will be the person who was the joint owner. You might have opened that bank account long back before marriage with your brother or father as joint holder and now forgot about this, but they are next legitimate owner of the bank account (or anything else). Note that nominations are useful to pass on the control only when no one is to claim it and WILL are to transfer the rights to someone after the owner is dead, but incase a joint account is there, the control can be passed only on the death of both the holders , not just the primary or secondary holder.

3. Not changing Old nominations and WILL

A lot of people do not change the nominations of their bank accounts, mutual funds, life insurance policies due to lazyness, someone else is on the nominee list, but they want to transfer the asset to some one else. A lot of people think that making a WILL is the final solution, but in real life, there can be complications. What if nominee and the person mentioned in a WILL are different ? The nominee can take out the cash from bank or do some transaction ? Then the legal owner will have to run from pillers to post to claim that money back and do all the legal work . See this classic issue on forgetting about the WILL

Hi , I am facing a big issue .. My husband had written a WILL long back stating that all the wealth should go to his brother after his death, but this happened years back, when we were having a lot of issues in marriage and fights, but after that everything was fine and things were on track. But seems like my husband never wrote another WILL after that and didnt change the WILL.  He died recently in an accident and now his brother has claimed all our property and bank balance because of that WILL . What can I do ?

Truely speaking , This lady cant do anything … her husband was ignorant about these things and now she will pay for his mistakes !

Some best practices

  • If you are 100% sure that your wealth should go to some specific person, always have a joint account with that person with you as primary person.
  • Make sure your nominee should be the same person you want to pass on some policy proceeds or property, It does not make sense to say in WILL that your wealth should go to A , but in nominee the name mentioned is B .
  • If you have opened any accounts/properties/mutual funds/policies long back , its a good idea to revisit it and see that the nominee name is appearing and is consistent with what you want it to be .

Joint Accounts, Nomination and Wills are all ways to pass on your wealth to someone else once you die, so it is very important that you structure these in the best possible manner. Have consistency in all these 3 things. If you pass on your money to a person better open account or buy the asset along as joint owner, make sure you put his name as nominee and also make sure that the WILL is written with clear directions.

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{ 124 comments… read them below or add one }

1 Rahul Parmar April 23, 2012 at 10:45 am

My father is 1st holder in MF with my sister as 2nd holder who is married 3 years back. I approached MF and asked them to change the 2nd holder and replace her name to my. MF refused to do so instead they suggested us to withdraw the amount and reinvest with new mandate? Is this the only way for change of second holder. Sister has no objection signing the paper of any sort.

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2 SP April 23, 2012 at 2:31 pm

In legal terms who will decide your sister is willing to withdraw her stake as 2nd holder. You may be forcing or threatening her to do so. If 2nd holder is changed and in future once your father be no more (may this not happen) and MF assets is of few lacs then the dispute is really painful to sort out. That is why AMC suggest you to close and start a new investment.

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3 Elaya Kumar S April 23, 2012 at 4:43 pm

The account is in the name of your father and sister. (It can be Former or survivor or Anyone or survivor). The fact of your sister getting married 3 years back does not alter the contracted account in the name of your father and sister.
The mutual fund is not deemed to take cognizance of your request to replace the name of your sister since you are not a party to the earlier account. Since your sister has no objection, please get a redemption form signed by your sister as well as your father and redeem the units and then open a fresh account in your name and your father’s name. That will be safest course.

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4 Melly Thomas April 23, 2012 at 11:05 am

Thanks for the nice article. I have a doubt. I have nominated my wife in all my mutual fund investments. But the Folios are in my name as Single. What is the procedure to convert them into ‘ Former or survivor mode as mentioned in the article?

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5 Elaya Kumar S April 23, 2012 at 4:46 pm

As things stand now, there is no provision in the Mutual fund units to include or delete the name of account holders. You can open a new account in your name and your wife’s name (Anyone or survivor or Former or survivor) and redeem the existing mutual fund units and make fresh purchases in the new account.

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6 Apurva Gandhi April 25, 2012 at 4:17 pm

Since there is no provision in the MF for inclusion or deletion of the names of account holders. The obvious choice would be to redeem the existing units. But watch out for short term capital gains that may arise if you do things in a hurry. You may make nomination(s) meanwhile, till the short term period is over. Later on you may redeem and reapply.

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7 Manish Chauhan April 23, 2012 at 6:19 pm

Melly

If she is nominee , then also make sure she is mentioned in the WILL .

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8 Prasoon April 23, 2012 at 11:11 am

If I am already a sole owner of Bank account and Mutual Fund, can I make my wife a joint holder now? Or is it at the time of Bank/MF account opening only?

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9 Elaya Kumar S April 23, 2012 at 4:48 pm

For Bank accounts, you can make your wife a joint holder by giving a separate request letter, after complying with KYC norms for bank accounts for your wife.
But in the case of mf units, you may open a new account in the joint names of yourself and your wife and redeem the existing mf units and thereafter repurchase in your new mf joint account.

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10 Soubhagya Kumar Patra April 23, 2012 at 11:43 am

Hi Rahul,
Answer to your query is.. Mutual Fund ownership is non-transferable, thus you cannot change the ownership from your sister to yourself.. So as suggested your father and sister can redeem the units and you can buy new unit having you as a joint holder with your father or sole owner..

Thank you

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11 Soubhagya Kumar Patra April 23, 2012 at 11:47 am

Hi Prasoon,
As replied to Rahul i.e. Mutual Fund ownership is non-transferable. this also means that once you purchase the MF as single ownership, then in future you can not add any holders to it. But yes adding second holder in Bank account is always possible..

Thank you..:-)

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12 sudhir April 23, 2012 at 12:05 pm

Very useful article.THANKS

A residential property is in the name of A .Ignoring wife(alive) ,can the names of two sisters of A be added as joint owner of the property with A .if yes ,what is the procedure of the same .

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13 Elaya Kumar S April 23, 2012 at 4:51 pm

For changing the ownership of immovable property, Transfer of Property Act is applicable. If the property is self acquired, A can change the ownership of the property, by executing a will, or a gift settlement deed or a sale deed.

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14 Damodaran P N April 23, 2012 at 12:30 pm

GOOD and useful information. Can I get a blank copy of a “WILL” document – just to see how is it written – its words and phrases. You can send to my email id.

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15 Elaya Kumar S April 23, 2012 at 5:01 pm

You can get the draft copy of will from the Government of Tamilnadu – Registration department website. (http://www.tnreginet.net/)

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16 Manish Chauhan April 23, 2012 at 6:21 pm
17 Jassi April 23, 2012 at 1:43 pm

Thanks for this article, Manish.
I have a query. My wife Priya is also working. Both of us have our own indivudual salaried accounts with HDFC.
We also have individual ICICI bank accounts (which were salaried accounts earlier with previous employer). Is it a good idea to merge these ICICI accounts (if at all its possible), or should we make each other joint account holder of each other’s accounts?

Also, same question for mutual funds ( we have own accounts for mutual funds and we use one FundsIndia login ).

Rgds,
Jassi

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18 Elaya Kumar S April 23, 2012 at 5:05 pm

For the salary accounts in your individual names, you can make the nominations.
For the ICICI bank accounts in your individual names you can make one account as joint one (preferably either or survivor) and close the other one.

For mutual funds you have to open separate accounts A, B, A & B (either or survivor) and that is possible with your fundsindia account.

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19 Manish Chauhan April 23, 2012 at 6:22 pm

Jassi

As suggested by Elaya, you should convert one of the ICICI bank accounts into Joint Account . And close the other one . So that way you will have 1 joint account and 1 individual account

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20 Apurva Gandhi April 25, 2012 at 6:29 pm

I would recommend that convert both the ICICI accounts into joint accounts, this way both of you can operate the accounts independently and yet have the benefit of joint accounts.

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21 Haladhar Panigrahi April 23, 2012 at 7:47 pm

Bank accounts are flexible in regards to nomination or making a single account into joint. Following KYC norms, both of you can give fresh mandate to the bank regarding this. You can add the other as joint account holder or you can put her name as nominee without disturbing the present status of the account.
As regards Mutual Fund, it differs from MF to MF. Some allow it, some insist on redemption. In the later case, MF remains more beneficial. All MFs should allow nomination at a later stage which does not affect the financial value of the fund.

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22 Jassi April 23, 2012 at 8:05 pm

Thanks for the reply.
Somehow, I feel adding nominee is better than closing one account and making the other as Joint, for two reasons.
1> Since both are working, for taxation purposes its better to have two accounts.
2>Closing one account from ICICI bank :) –> I am sure it will not be easy to do this and they persuade me to the best not to close an account :)

Rgds,
Jassi

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23 Umesh April 23, 2012 at 2:26 pm

A well written article in which only advantages of joint account holding is mentioned. Please do state some disadvantages as well.

I think, one will be the taxation. Calculation of individual income out of a joint account holding will be a difficult job and this will require the advice of some expert or CA. How will you calculate and divide the interest income or dividend or capital gains, among them.

Or you just mean to open and use accounts individually and for formality get the other name as 2nd holder.

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24 N.M.R.Shreedhar April 23, 2012 at 3:52 pm

Taxes will be borne by the first holder, also dividends will be issued in the name of the first holder. However for redemption purpose, like in MF units, all holders have to sign–all MF houses are not strict abt this, some evn accept for redemption with only first a/c holder’s sign.
regds

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25 Elaya Kumar S April 23, 2012 at 5:07 pm

For the salary and accounting purposes the accounts in the individual names may be continued with registration of nomination. For other purposes, you can maintain a separate joint account (Any one or survivor).

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26 SP April 23, 2012 at 2:28 pm

A good eye opener article. I have one query to ask, in nominations, we just specify the name, relationship and date of birth but never provide any photograph or Id like Voter id, PAN number etc. In such situation what is credibility of assigning a nomination?
Just to share that I know multiple cases where improper set up of nomination, absense of any Will or joint accounts can leads to getting you the money and assets but after a very long (10-20 years) of legal struggle, provided there be no dispute or dissent in the family but if there be any, forget about your hard earned money going to right person. So make sure your parents make a will right today and you should make a plan and set up joint accounts/ownership.

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27 Manish Chauhan April 23, 2012 at 6:26 pm

Yes .. just doing the nomination is not the answer, but having something in nomination is much better than keeping it blank

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28 Raja April 23, 2012 at 3:24 pm

Hi Manish,

One of the problems i faced in the recent past, while taking a term insurance from LIC is, they won’t allow me to divide the nomination between my wife and mother in the ratio that i want. They said 50-50 is the only way i can do it. So, i had to take a different policy to work around this issue as i didn’t want a 50-50 divide.

Do you know, why this is so ? or if this is a real constraint from LIC ? Or was it just my agents imagination ?

Regards
Raja

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29 Manish Chauhan April 23, 2012 at 6:27 pm

Raja

It might happen that there was not “ratio” column in the form and only names column, which makes it EQUAL by default .

Manish

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30 Raja April 24, 2012 at 9:14 pm

So you mean to say The Largest insurance company in India never ever felt the need for it’s customers to allocate the nomination in desired ration than have it divided in equal ratio ?

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31 Manish Chauhan April 25, 2012 at 9:40 am

I am just throwing what I think can be the case, not very sure of that .. what else can be the reason logically :)

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32 Raja April 25, 2012 at 9:42 am

Yah… But the reason sounds like… you know… you have so many interactive reader’s just because you were lucky to chose a good domain name ‘jagoinvestor’… i know i know…bad example… just kidding :)

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33 Ram Mohan April 23, 2012 at 5:37 pm

Hi Manish,

My wife is nominee in my mutual fund investments and demat account. What is the procedure to convert this into a joint account? Also, there is some problem with her PAN card due to which I’m unable to make her joint account owner in certain places. Is having her as nominee a good solution or do you forsee any problems?

thanks,.

Ram

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34 Manish Chauhan April 23, 2012 at 6:16 pm

Ram

You need to understand what is “nominee” , she has right to recieve the funds from your MF and Demat , but she is not the legal owner per se . She will get everything if there is no dispute , but if your parents / children tomm ask for share, she will have to do it . I would say just make a WILL stating that she is the owner of everything after your death . That should be full proof.

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35 Ram Mohan April 23, 2012 at 6:26 pm

Thanks Manish

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36 Apurva Gandhi April 25, 2012 at 6:50 pm

‘Nominee of shares superior to legal heirs’. The law on nomination of shares held in companies has taken a new meaning with perhaps the first interpretation of the provisions governing nomination in the Companies Act, 1956 by the Bombay high court.

Check this link: http://legalperspectives.blogspot.in/2010/05/shares-vest-in-nominee-and-not-heirs.html

In other words, see to it that the nominee and the legal heirs (as per the will) are same. In a single demat account you may not be able to make different nominations for different securities held under that account. More important is to fill up the demat form yourself (do not let the banker/demat agent do this)

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37 Manish Chauhan April 26, 2012 at 5:17 pm

Yes Apurva

I am aware of it and already wrote about it in my earliar article on nomination : http://www.jagoinvestor.com/2010/10/will-your-nominee-get-the-money-on-your-death.html

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38 Sunil Kumar April 23, 2012 at 6:18 pm

Hi Manish!

Can u tell me about Edelweiss Life Insurance New Product “Cash Protection” is that good or bad???

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39 Manish Chauhan April 23, 2012 at 6:47 pm

Sunil

All these kind of plans are all same traditional or ULIP types.. just ignore it

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40 Sunil Kumar April 24, 2012 at 10:50 am

Hello Manish,

I hav already jeevan saral 24020/- plan. I already paid 2 installment and next due in june 2012. what can i do paid 3rd installment & paid up or surrender after 5 years (agent said to me if i surrender after 5 year full amount back to me)?

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41 Manish Chauhan April 24, 2012 at 7:18 pm

Yes , in this plan , looks like after 5 yrs ,you will all the money , check the website of LIC , it says so

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42 Vipin Mohan April 23, 2012 at 6:51 pm

Dear manish,

I hold
1) A demat cum savings account with ICICI (earlier it was a salary accnt) (Nominee-father)
2) Savings account with SBI (Nominee-father)
3) PPF account with SBI (same branch)(Nominee-wife)
4) Salary account with HDFC.(Nominee-father)
I declared my father as nominee in 1,2 & 4. Recently I got married and I would like to change the nominee to my wife. How can I do it? Is it a difficult process?
Is it possible on all 1,2 & 3 to convert it to a Joint Account with my wife??
What are the possibilities other than writing a will??
I really don’t want my wife to run from pillars to post to claim if something happens to me.

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43 Manish Chauhan April 23, 2012 at 6:58 pm

Vipin

While your wife would be the legal heir after you and should get the money, still its better to make sure she is nominee is all the things and even write a WILL stating clearly that she is the final owner for 100% of the things . For 1,2,4 there are specific forms to be submitted so that the nominee can be changed. You need to find it out . Do some homework on this

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44 bemoneyaware April 24, 2012 at 8:42 am

A must read article. After seeing my relatives struggling after the death of their loved ones, we realized the importance of keeping paper work in order.
Most of us assume that our family will get access to our investments, bank accounts when we are no more but the law doesn’t recognize things this way. It needs valid papers in the form of Survivorship mandate, Nominations, Will. At a time of loss, loved ones are usually in deep turmoil and legalities can compound the turmoil. The right paper work goes a long way in getting your money to those you love.
We have covered the topic in details starting with Right Paper Work For Those You Love: Part 1

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45 Manish Chauhan April 24, 2012 at 7:20 pm

Thanks for your views :)

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46 Nilufer April 24, 2012 at 10:32 am

A very informative article.. thank you.. keep up the good work.

As soon as i read this post i called HDFC Bank where I have my salary account, and second name in the said account is my son’s.. On checking the procedure for changing operations instructions from either or survivor to former or survivor. I came to know of this instruction “Former or Survivor” only via your post. But i was told that “Former or Survivor” operation instructions are no more in operation. It is either “either or Survivor” or “anyone or Survivor”. Why would “former or survivor” not be applicable at a renowned bank like HDFC??

I wanted to change the instructions, as everytime i need to open an FD or a Recurring from the said account, the same needs both our signatures.

Do let me know please if “Former or Survivor” mode of operation is not applicable to banks.

Rgds,
Nilufer

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47 Manish Chauhan April 24, 2012 at 7:19 pm

It might be the case that not all banks have it , but this looks like a standard RBI thing , and its tough to imagine how a bank does not have former or survivor option , whereas other banks have it .

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48 Nilufer April 25, 2012 at 11:04 am

Hi Manish,

Let me go online and write to their customer care about this, so that they can send me a revert in writing… that way atleast it will be certain that this operating facility is not available with them..

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49 Manish Chauhan April 25, 2012 at 4:22 pm

Yes .. please do that

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50 Durga Prasad April 24, 2012 at 12:39 pm

Hi Prasoon,
I am sure that at any point of time, you can make your wife joint holder.
Please check about MF too, I think thats also possible.

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51 harish April 24, 2012 at 7:06 pm

Hai Manish u r doing great job. i hav learnt lot of things from ur blog.
I hav small query. One of my frd had taken 10lakhs housing loan with 11.75% for 15 years from CANARA BANK last year. His EMI amount is approx 13700/-. I hav calculated EMI amount with the help of http://emi-calculator.com/ .It is coming around 11,841/-. He asked this with bank manager. but now he is tellling like they hav calculaed EMI amount for 14 years as 12 months will be considered as holiday. but he has to pay for 15 years. Is there any such type of rule for housing loan?.. (he has not taken any insurance with housing loan ). how can v solve this problem???. plz help us..
Thanx n Regards,
Harish

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52 Manish Chauhan April 24, 2012 at 7:14 pm

Harish

I have never heard anything like this , ask him to check with bank manager for a written proof of this . Also start a thread on our forum to do more discussion on this : http://www.jagoinvestor.com/forum

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53 harish April 24, 2012 at 7:25 pm

K thankQ.. Do they consider any other factor while calculating EMI ?..

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54 Manish Chauhan April 25, 2012 at 9:44 am

No

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55 Srinivas April 25, 2012 at 4:44 pm

Along with the allotment letter, bank will give an amortisation sheet where they will show monthly payment and how interest and principal gets reduced for the entire tenure.

Let your friend get the same. With this anyone can cross check how the calculation is being done.

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56 Vipin Mohan April 24, 2012 at 9:12 pm

Dear Manish ji,

Who are the Legal Heirs–
1) After the death of a married women?
2) After death of a married man?
Assuming that 1 & 2 have children, husband/wife, mother, father,siblings.
Who are Class 1 heirs? and Class 2 heirs? Can class 2 heirs claim assets if Class 1 (intestate condition) heirs are still alive? Please clarify.

Most of the internet sources I have gone through contains different answers varying from each other. Thats why I would like to confirm it from JI, a reliable source.

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57 Manish Chauhan April 25, 2012 at 9:42 am

Vipin

Let me come up with an article on that .. very soon

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58 C.V. Easwaran April 25, 2012 at 5:57 am

My wife and I have covered all points in your article except nomination. All our accounts/MFs are Joint E or S. My children are abroad. Our WILL is clear to give all our wealth 50-50 to our children & an executor has been appointed. A concern which I have not been able to address is since we both travel almost always together, what happens to our accounts/MFs if (GOD forbid) we both do not survive an accident. Any easy solutions other than making nominations for each individual investment?

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59 Manish Chauhan April 25, 2012 at 9:38 am

No , in our case nominations are missing and if that is so , a big issue for your children will be to claim the money from MF etc, they will need to produce the proofs that they are your legal heirs . I clearly see a lot of hassle incase you both are around at the same time . I really suggest that in your next visit to India, you should really fix this issue

Manish

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60 C.V. Easwaran April 25, 2012 at 9:51 pm

Manish – thanks for the prompt response. But your reply is a bit confusing – can you clarify what you want us to do exactly. By the way we are in India mostly but travel abroad together for 2-3 months.

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61 Manish Chauhan April 26, 2012 at 5:13 pm

All I am saying is “nominations” section should not be BLANK , please update all the banks accounts/MF saying that the nominee are your children , its a small change which you need to do by filling up nomination forms . Enquire it at the bank and MF side .

Manish

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62 Sunil Kumar April 25, 2012 at 4:05 pm

i open ppf account with rs. 500/- on 04.01.2012 & deposit rs. 6000/- on 05.02.2012 but on 31.03.2012 interest entered on that amount rs. 97/- how it is calculate??? please help me.

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63 Manish Chauhan April 25, 2012 at 4:18 pm
64 Sony April 25, 2012 at 11:00 pm

Very Good article.Thanks a lot for your good work.
I have a Q.
I have joint account with my Dad and I sent money to that account for my parents.Does this joint account means that I have more right than my sister,if my parents right the WILL and give more propery to my sister.Or does this joint account means that I will be the owner for this bank account only or owner of all the property held by my Dad.Thanks a lot.

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65 Manish Chauhan April 26, 2012 at 5:09 pm

Sony

Joint account, means “jointly owned” . So after your dad, you are the owner of the account. But for rest of the things where you are not jointly owner, it will go as per will or succession act

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66 Anand April 27, 2012 at 10:16 am

very informative site. thanks a lot
I have self aquired office space in karol bagh, delhi.For the purpose of taking car loan from a bank ,in her name I want to include her name in the property for getting waitage in bank loan application. She is a teacher in a public school & gets 35000/-p.m salary. The papers I have is registered sale deed. pls advise.

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67 Anand April 27, 2012 at 10:23 am

In my opinion this site can be helpful to masses in many areas. thanks

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68 Anand April 27, 2012 at 10:55 am

i have a Q
I have self aquired office space in karol bagh new delhi.the papers of property i have is redistered sale deed. it is free hold.Now i want my wife to be its owner .what papers should be made for this.pls reply

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69 Manish Chauhan April 28, 2012 at 12:14 pm

Anand

This would require a lawyer for guidance

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70 Anand April 28, 2012 at 8:54 pm

thanks for yr advise. I will be obliged if you may suggest a lawyers site
regards

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71 Manish Chauhan May 1, 2012 at 11:48 am

Anand

I am not aware of any lawyer like this . You better meet a local lawyer !

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72 Shalini April 28, 2012 at 10:23 pm

My father had a joint account with me and my mother in “Either or Survivor” mode with United Bank of India.Two months ago, my father passed away…Now the Branch manager is insisting that we close this account as first/primary account holder is dead. Is this the rule in “Either or Survivor” mode ? Can’t we continue using the account, deleting the name of my father ??

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73 Manish Chauhan May 1, 2012 at 11:45 am

Shalini

Obviously you can continue the account ,ask the bank manager the rule about the Joint accounts and what happens to it after the primary holder’s death . Ask him to show RBI rules !

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74 Shalini May 4, 2012 at 6:30 pm

Thanks a lot for your help, Manish.

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75 Madhab April 29, 2012 at 9:55 am

Recently my father passed away, we found that all his accounts were joint accounts with my mother (either or survivor). It has turned out to be a boon for us. My mom is now able to withdraw cash from the accounts. However there is a FD in Vijaya Bank which too is a joint a/c. When we wanted to close the FD by doing a premature withdrawal the bank manager informed us following –
“In case of a joint FD in either or survivor mode if any of the owner passes away, then the survivor gets the FD only on maturity. He or she can’t make a premature withdrawal.”
This was a surprise for us, but the manager also showed us the circular from RBI stating the same. I am not sure what is it the RBI want to achieve from this but I find it a little odd as it will be a problem for people who will be in need of money.

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76 Manish Chauhan May 1, 2012 at 11:43 am

I guess thats the rule ! .. SO your mother will have to wait for the FD to mature ! ..

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77 Jagdish R Bhatt May 2, 2012 at 11:12 pm

Sir, my grandfather has agricultural lands but before his death he has hadn’t written any will. Farmers are not giving any produce. My father is the youngest among 6 brothers. My eldest uncle is no more but my aunt is there. How can we get the property? Though in some land records my grandpa’s name is there we are not able to do anything. Kindly enlighten me how to proceed. We do not pay any tax for the past 15 yrs or so.My grandfather left for heavenly abode on 15-11-1995.

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78 Manish Chauhan May 3, 2012 at 10:42 am

Jagdish

If you do not have strong papers for the land , how will you claim it at all ? First thing is you need solid paper work for it proving that it was your grandpa’s land . Next if the will is missing , the land will be divided equally among all the 6 son

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79 Shahana May 5, 2012 at 5:35 am

Hi I have one question. My husband has a joint account with his sister when he was single and we decided to get married the thing is my husband passed away few months after and he don’t have any will and did to change anything or add me on his bank account or the joint account. I just want to know if I have any right on the said joint account?

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80 Manish Chauhan May 5, 2012 at 12:08 pm

I really doubt if you can claim it , the sister is the joint account holder and she would be the next owner of that account .

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81 sty May 12, 2012 at 8:17 pm

Important point to note in without WILL circumstance:
Nominee becomes absolute owner of the equity shares if the deceased dies without WILL. No (intestate-witout WILL) succesion law applies & legal heirs do not have any right qua equity shares. Only WILL can over rule nominee in this circumstance. Whereas in all other instruments like bank account/fdr/insurance a nominee is only like trustee (postman) who takes the money & gives it to the legal heirs (This is true for WILL or without WILL).

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82 Manish Chauhan May 14, 2012 at 6:28 pm

Yes .. thats correct . I have already taken care of these points in my earliar article : http://www.jagoinvestor.com/2010/10/will-your-nominee-get-the-money-on-your-death.html

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83 lalit July 13, 2012 at 7:04 am

I have query here, suppose i open joint saving accnt with my father and i am supposed to surrender my LIC/ULIP policies. So can i provide this joint accnt details while asking LIC/or other firm to liquidate my holding [ those policy/ULIP is on my name, my father's name is no where mentioned ] and transfer amount to Joint account electronically ?

In short, can money be transferred from liquidating investments which is on the name of one of the joint account holder ?

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84 Manish Chauhan July 13, 2012 at 9:28 am

Obviously yes !

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85 Yogita July 23, 2012 at 8:24 pm

hi…
My father had a joint account with my mother in “single” mode operation (as bank told us) with IDBI bank and one FD with having sister as nominee.One months ago, my father passed away…Now the Branch manager is insisting ( force to us) that we close this account as first/primary account holder is dead. Can’t we continue using the account, deleting the name of my father ?? and also he said to broke the FD before maturity. so what we have to do??? I told him that the account is joint but they didnt listent anything from us and force to close the account. Please Help us
also there are same condition in others banks so what we have to do . and also my father have some FD with single holder and no nominee so what is the proceduer in this case..

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86 Manish Chauhan July 24, 2012 at 8:45 pm

Yogita

You can still use it , the second holder will be the able to control it , just give the death certificate and fill up the forms required by them and your mother should be able to operate it . Which bank is it , ask them to show you the rules of Joint accounts, ask them that you have done a RTI query with RBI and you came to know that there is no rule of closing the existing account which was joint account.

Manish

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87 Yogita July 24, 2012 at 10:00 pm

thanks…
its IDBI bank… and they told us that account type is single ( ie not either or surviour)
also can u tell me we have to still give the Income tax to govt for my father’s income that he save till death??
but i thought he always pay income tax when he earning money and save that money for future. but now aftr death thr is no income of my father but thr are saving in bank so till we have to pay income tax for those saving money???

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88 Lalith August 4, 2012 at 4:51 am

Can we accept a nomination on a joint account which can be operated either party? If so what are the precautions we should take. Kindly advise.

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89 Manish Chauhan August 4, 2012 at 12:07 pm

Nominations is just one , both joint holders do not have it sepreately !

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90 Tara October 20, 2012 at 2:11 pm

My father had joint FDs with his brother, who in his Will had left his movable assets to his legal heirs and immovable property to my father. However, the heirs are asking for the entire money to be given to them and are pressurising the bank not to let my father encash the FD after maturity. The bank has now asked my father to obtain a probate. Do the legal heirs have a right over the total amount of money? Can the bank ask for a probate since the FDs had an ‘either or survivor’ clause?

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91 Manish Chauhan October 22, 2012 at 10:21 am

If its a joint account, then your father shoudl be the owner of that .

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92 Tara November 3, 2012 at 2:27 pm

Thank you. I shall take up the matter with the higher authorities in the bank.

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93 Manish Chauhan November 6, 2012 at 4:46 pm

yes

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94 Naren October 29, 2012 at 12:14 pm

Hi Manish,
I would like to know why is it Important to make a Will. Also if you can tell me about the laws relating to Muslim.

Regards

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95 Manish Chauhan October 30, 2012 at 10:24 am
96 Sanjay November 6, 2012 at 11:10 pm

I want ensure that after I die, none of my relatives get single paisa of mine.

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97 Manish Chauhan November 12, 2012 at 9:22 am

Write a WILL

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98 Jagadish November 15, 2012 at 8:32 am

Hi Manish
Your webiste is very nice . I have a question . My father owns a house . He built the house on BDA (Bangalore Development authority ) allotted site . Me and my brother are his two sons. I came to know that there will be issues for transfering the property rights to us after our father’s demise . I was suggested to convert this property to joint holding ( father and two sons ) so that after father’s demise transfer of the property rights will be easier .

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99 Manish Chauhan November 15, 2012 at 7:15 pm

Joint property is the best thing . but there should not be much issue if all the documents are in place, like WILL , Nominee in the share certificate of the society ! etc etc . and obviosuly , the relation between brothers !

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100 sunderarajan November 19, 2012 at 1:34 pm

dear shri manish ji, i think a joint account can be of help even when a person is not yet dead but is down with some illness, wherein he or she is not able to even sign the withdrawal form/ cheque. in such cases, the joint holder [s] will be able to take out money that may be urgently needed for treatment etc etc. otherwise, if there is a shortfall in family corpus, the family members will have to take loan from friends/relatives/ bank etc etc, even while their money will be available in their bank account. is that not so?

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101 Manish Chauhan November 20, 2012 at 3:24 pm

Yes, thats a very valid point :)

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102 Sanghmitra November 20, 2012 at 1:49 pm

Hey Manish,

For wife to be mentioned as nominee, which complete name is appropriate – maiden name or post marriage surname. If the PAN CARD and rest legal docs are with maiden name?

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103 Manish Chauhan November 20, 2012 at 1:56 pm

There is nothing like that . As our indian law does not make it mandatory for a women to change her name after marriage, any name is fine . Its a personal choice for you which one to use . Just that you should be able to prove your identity and relationship later. For simplicity purpose, use the document which has same name as in your marriage certificate.

Manish

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104 Sanghmitra November 20, 2012 at 2:37 pm

So if husband mentioned post marriage surname of his wife as nominee for insurance policy…but wife’s bank a/c and Pan Card is in maiden name…can insurance co. make issues at the time of death claim?

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105 Manish Chauhan November 20, 2012 at 2:45 pm

They will definately ask for proofs and documents . At that time, then you will have to arrange for documents . Note that company will need documents as per the NOminee Name , better ask husband to change the nominee name .

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106 Sanghmitra November 21, 2012 at 2:22 pm

Okies…
btw..this discussion thread is very good…Looking fwd to more on ‘nomination part only’ as for different products.

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107 Manish Chauhan November 25, 2012 at 11:55 am
108 amarjeet November 29, 2012 at 7:33 pm

I am amarjeet my father holds an a/c in state bank of patiyala for which he nominated my mother and we wish to continue the same a/c in my mother is name due to our emotional attachment is it possible that my mother can use the same a/c as bank manager is forcing us to cease it

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109 Manish Chauhan November 30, 2012 at 10:49 am

She can just continue it , why is the RM forcing to close it ? there is no reason for it !

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110 sam December 26, 2012 at 7:17 am

Hello Manish
I have been an avid reader of your blog for quite some time and seek your advice on a rather strange matter. My mother has a few fixed deposits jointly with my father , who is deceased now. These term deposits are in either or survivor mode. My mother wishes to prematurely withdraw these term deposits , however the bank is asking for indemnity , in the form of form16/bank statement etc of two other individuals who are not family members. Which means I cannot provide any indemnity in this matter nor am I allowed to write a no objection.
I fail to understand the point in having fd’s in either or survivor mode.
Here is a note and circular from RBI in such matters , explaining clearly either or survivor clause and premature withdrawals :

http://www.rbi.org.in/scripts/NotificationUser.aspx?Id=7523&Mode=0

I am completely at a loss here. I do not understand how I can ask for the form 16 and bank statement of a 3rd party ( not a family member) , so that my mother can withdraw her own money ?? !!

please advice
regards
sam

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111 Manish Chauhan December 29, 2012 at 8:58 pm

Is it PSU bank ? If yes, check using RTI what are the rules

If its a private bank, tell the manager that you are complaining to Banking ombudsman on this , and if they care of explain they shoudl show you the RBI rules on this matter . I think bank is just trying to create hurdles so that the money lies in bank and they make use of it !

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112 Manish Chauhan December 29, 2012 at 9:01 pm

JUst realised this point from the circular

2. In this connection, it is clarified that if fixed/term deposit accounts are opened with operating instructions ‘Either or Survivor’, the signatures of both the depositors need not be obtained for payment of the amount of the deposits on maturity. However, the signatures of both the depositors may have to be obtained, in case the deposit is to be paid before maturity. If the operating instruction is ‘Either or Survivor’ and one of the depositors expires before the maturity, no pre-payment of the fixed/term deposit may be allowed without the concurrence of the legal heirs of the deceased joint holder. This, however, would not stand in the way of making payment to the survivor on maturity.

It says that if its a premature withdrawal , then bank is suppose to make sure its going to LEGAL HEIR , not in your mind and world, you are so sure that you are legal heirs, but it does not work that way , bank needs PROOF , so either being a WILL saying that your father wanted to give it to the mother, or if will is not present , then succession certificate is required .

I think you are clear on this point , bank is moving as per RBI notification only , you got my point ?

Manish

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113 Naval Shah January 18, 2013 at 11:51 am

Dear manish,

can i add my wife name as a nominee on my salary account???

as i have discussed with axis bank,they told me that it is possible for you to add her name as nominee but at time of receiving PF i am facing lot of issue due to jont account.

so what to do..

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114 Manish Chauhan January 18, 2013 at 11:57 am

You can always add her as joint account holder, just understand the implications of it . Also depends what mode you are adding her with

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115 Nanda April 11, 2013 at 4:59 pm

My wife passed away recently. Although most of her insurance policy had me as the nominee. She had not mentioned the nominee in her bank account and for some of the MF’s she was holding. What will be the procedure to be followed for getting the same transferred.

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116 Manish Chauhan April 12, 2013 at 10:15 am

You will have to bring a Succession certificate from court now to prove that you are the legal heir

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117 vijayaphadnis April 24, 2013 at 7:26 pm

My father-in-law and mother-in-law have a joint fixed deposit account in State bank of India. Two months back, my father-in-law expired. The bank manager is saying that he will terminate the account and give a payorder to the nominee (incidentally my brother in law is the nominee). My mother-in-law wants to continue the account in her name as she does not want to lose the interest by closing the account prematurely. What is the significance of a joint account, if the second a/c holder does not have any say?
In a joint account with a nominee, who gets the right – joint a/c holder or the nominee?

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118 Manish Chauhan April 26, 2013 at 11:20 am

No he cant do that. Ask the manager about the rules and tell him you fill file RTI for that to understand the rules. If joint account is there, then it has to be continued with the another person .

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119 Lokesh July 3, 2013 at 8:30 pm

Excellent article…i am inclined to now convert my single holding accounts.
Has anyone converted their single account to Joint with ICICI? If yes:

1) Is there any issue with ECS/auto-debits/auto-credits/SIs that are already setup?
2) Any issues with linked Debit/Credit cards?
3) Is existing cheque book (single holder name printed on cheque leaves) fine or needs to be replaced?

Planning to convert my salary account, but want to make sure i dont mess up the current setup.

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120 Manish Chauhan July 5, 2013 at 10:03 am

understand the problem with joint account. There can be taxation issues and if your relationship goes for a toss in future, it will be tough to unfold it

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121 neelim dutta August 6, 2013 at 8:23 pm

hi,manish – i’m a regular reader of jagoinvestor and i’m really enriched wih your updates on financial planning.i’ve a querry i.e. me and my wife have salaried savings acc.at sbi.now,we are considering of having a joint acc.to plan our day today expenditures.can you please suggest how do we go about in opening the joint acc.thanking you,regards – neelim.

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122 Manish Chauhan August 9, 2013 at 10:19 am

All you need is to carry your both ID and address proof and tell the bank you want to open joint account. they will take care of the procedure !

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123 Dhev June 1, 2014 at 9:19 am

Hi,
I need a clarification, My (late) father and I had a joint account as former or suvivor, but another third person had produced a will stating that the money in the account belongs to him as per the will, so the bank people kept the account and loan against the account as it is- stating that there is a dispute.
How to go about this, Does the will stand stronger or the joint account?
kindly help.
Thanks.

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124 Manish Chauhan June 11, 2014 at 11:36 am

No , incase of JOINT account , a WILL Is of not use ! .. check with a good lawyer now !

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