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POSTED BY ON November 15, 2012 COMMENTS (90)
Are you a real estate expert ! ? If yes, please help a fellow reader Yakgna Kumar, who has been suffering due to his mistake by investing in a real estate project in Chennai . He wants a right direction and hence he is asking everybody help to guide him. Below is his story from our questions and answers forum
We booked IB Greens apartment in chennai Oct 2010, Initial booking was made with promises that are not being fulfilled by IB now. They dragged the agreement signing for 2 years quoting various reasons and until now they are not clear on number of floors, UDS. Now that, they have come up with new agreement – completely one sided and no clear indication of number of floor, UDS, SBA Increase, change in carpet area/floor plan, shared club house for different phases as against separate club house and many other issues. This is clearly a Cheating case !
We have now applied for cancellation of the booking and asking IB to refund the complete amount paid for booking the apartment, IB is not responding on the details of refund but when we call customer care, they are quoting that we need to pay penalty of 5% of total sale price ! – this is mentioned in the Booking Agreement, the booking agreement also says, that agreement should be made within 1 year of the booking, if the booking is not made within 1 year of the booking IB will have to pay 9% interest … in addition to this, they have added few clauses that cancellation should not be intitiated by buyers. Now IB is asking us to sign a cancellation process which makes us to agree for penalty as per booking agreement.
With our little knowledege on real estate, we understand
1. The booking agreement is not an agreement and and just provisional booking form.
2. its been more than 2 years old and when exceeds 6 months it will become null and void.
3. As per the CCI(competation commission of India) any terms and conditions which is one sided is not acceptable and considered as Void.
4. Our refund request is not our own and because of IB failure to deliver the project intime. Till date they are not clear it will be 7 floor or 19 floor. During booking they informed 7 floors and if 19 floor your UDS is almost nil which is deviation from the booking terms.
Questions
1) what should be our step to get the refund, have you seen customers approaching with this kind of problems and how they have handled it?. we have lost 2 years since then the real estate prices have gone up, IB can cancel our booking and sell with latest price and making profit. we have already went through too much stress because of IB attitude towards us and IB billing department asking to pay the first installment without even signing the agreement and also penalty of 18% for delay in payments . we had multiple meeting with IB staff without any change in IB stand on the agreement and so we are planning to cancel. I am attaching the booking agreement snip related to the cancellation/refund from booking agreement. We are a team of buyers, we got introduced yourself after forming a google group when we had to face the problems from IB. We are stuck now, we need correct plan of action and without any further delay and stress for us. Based on your expertise, i would request you to let us know the next steps for us.
2) Will we be able to get our monies back based on the booking agreement? .. is the booking agreement considered at all after 2 years ?
3) We also think, the IB Higher Management may not be aware of the staff and local management’s attitude to customers, if there a way to escalate our issues?
Appreciate your time on reading this long mail. thanks for your support.
What do you think about this case ? Can you share what do you think about this cheating case and how this guy should move ahead, what should be his next actions ?
2021 © Jagoinvestor.com All Right Reserved
Dear Yakgna Kumar,
It is unforutnate to hear indiabulls conduct. It is pertinent to note that as per various judgements of the NCDRC, you are entitled to a complete refund @ 12% for the relevant period. Please consider sending a legal notice and subsequently pursuing a consumer complaint.
Please note considering IB’s failure to execute the buyer agreement within a year, you’re not required to pay any amount (5% or otherwise) to the developer.
Hello, is there any update on IB phase 2? Is there a group where we can get more information on their plans?
Hi Even I had booked in phase-2. Compact 2BHK in G-Block. But their payment demands are arbitrary and no proper response from the customer care.
We dont have any update on that!
15th floor construction is going on
Hi All,
Finally I got my hard earned money back along with a interest of 9% from Indiabulls. Any one need assistance in getting their money back let me know. We need to form a group and shut this project as our hard earned money is enjoyed by Indiabulls.
Great to know that !
Please let me know..
i also need my money back..
It must be money laundering way..
Please let me know..Thanks in advance
my mail id -baskarg23@gmail.com
u can call me 9884955252
This is to clarify that Mr. Stalin Nadar was a defaulter in making payment towards his installments in the project Indiabulls Greens Chennai. There was an inordinate delay in all his payments. Due to his inability to make payments, he opted for cancellation. Indiabulls as a goodwill gesture waived off his interest outstanding (due to delay in making payments by Stalin) and processed his refund. Also it is misrepresented by Mr. Nadar that interest of 9% was given to him. No such interest payment was given to him by the company.
Thanks for the reply in this forum by the company.
Please answer the following,
If I write to you officially, for 100% refund of amount paid so far, with interest, after the date mentioned in agreement for handing over inclusive of grace period, will you refund it without any hassles?
Those who are invested in Phase 2, IB Greens -Please share your mobile nos, so that, whatsapp group can be formed, and we can share our concerns through that. I think, it will be useful.
My name is Aravind book a flat in IB Ph-2, add my number is whatsapp 309-660-7282 (US)
add my no 9841281808 – I m on complaining process.. guys can join us..
Why cant we take up this with Media ? .. As we have a contacts
Please add me 9686722998
Regards
Senthilkumar
Is there anyone from this forum live in chennai, who can give us an current update of the project…
Hi Arvind , I dont think you will get any answer like that
Recently I received one mail from customer care that they got CMDA approval(CMDA ref no 9020 . ) usually CMDA updated their site monthly ones. we can check it in the CMDA site -1 st week of Aug 15 .
The mail states only approval or demanding money? please clarify.
Baskar
I mean update about that construction, when I spoke to them they are saying it will b ready by 2016 September . Just want to know whether you have any other informations..
No idea
Is it true that the construction will be completed by 2016 Sepetember. When I called up IB they said, it will be completed only by 2019.
Kindly help me with latest and genuine update.
Is there any update ther Manish?
Update for what ? I didnt get it ?
I am also an investor on IB Ph-2, a new POC for all NRI people.
His name is Venkat and his no. +91 7401-683601. He replace Murugesan.
Hi Sushil & Manish,
Please share me your contact # at stalin.nadar4981@gmail.com or call me on +7768004297
They have recv’d GO order for 19 floors. Cleberation mood in IB 🙁
Hi senthil
Thanks for your sharing your valuable comment on this topic. Please keep sharing your views in future also
Manish
Hi Manish & Sushil,
Please share me your contact number or call me on +91-7768004297.
I am also a victim of IB Phase 2, I am invested since 2009, and no signs of get things. I am paying huge EMI as well.
Is there group of people who have invested in IB greens Chennai Phase 2. The only way we can justice and our hard earned money is being united and fight against these greedy corrupt corporate.
Please let me if a group exist which I can join or else we can form a group and fight for each other.
Sushil Menon
Hi Sushil Menon
I am not sure if a big group exists ! ..
same thing is happend with for multiple projects
1. Cascade Greens
2. Sierra Vizag
Thanks for sharing that !
For all those who have booked in phase2 and in phase1, a recent news. The ground water in indiabulls is depleting & depleted this summer, impact – no water to wash the shit. they are buying daily 60-70k lts of water which is not sufficient. Imagine once phase2 comes into existence. henceforth please decide more than once before booking!!
Thanks for sharing that Naveen , its scary !
Indiabulls is taking the customers of GREENS, PANVEL for a ride. Five years after booking flats in phase-1, this builder has not yet given possession. They are asking to wait another 18-24 months. Indiabulls has sold flats in phase-2 three years back. Still they keep saying “we can’t help…. we are waiting for approvals from Govt.” !!! Can you believe this ??? Coolly diverted hundreds of crores of money from phase-2 customers to buying land in other areas… giving the same damn response for 3 years. They cheaters and fraudsters must be behind bars immediately. Starting from the sales staff to customer care upto the CEO of Indiabulls real estate…. all should be taught a lesson.
Sameer
thanks for sharing that with all ! ..
Indiabulls have clearly defrauded customers in Panvel, Chennai, and i’m sure in many other projects too.
It’s good to see someone has taken Indiabulls to court for all their misdeeds. Indiabulls customers have been guilty of looking the other way fully knowing they were being cheated.
Burying your head in sand when faced with danger is a good strategy for ostriches. Turning over and playing dead is also good for survival when you want to escape a bear. But when faced with a bull, you have to take it by the horns.
Check out the following article:
http://indianexpress.com/article/cities/mumbai/nothing-much-to-write-home-about/99/
Take them to the cleaners, don’t take any more bullshit
Thansk for sharing this !
kumar614 –> S.n of a b..ch. Are you supporting Indiabulls? Are you part of that M..t.er f..ker family?.Listen Indiabulls cannot promote any booking after phase-2 apart from crap NRI’s by placing stalls in UAE & other countries and the completion of the same after approval will minimum take 3-4 years. And all for what Indiabulls had done even being a big a.s hole. It already lost its reputation and no more further bookings after phase-2 until and unless he adresses the compalints of phase-1 and phase-2 customers all positively, Dear phase-2 you try to do something wise get your money back by all possible means and dear phase-1 customers your building is best prone to earthquake and feel happy that he stopped with 7 floors instead of cheating you like what he did for poor phase-2 customers. Phase-1 & phase-2 customers please form a communtiy to have strong unity & also help fellow citizens from trapping into a Ditch named Indiabulls.
I thank one of the Indiabulls customer of phase-2 who saved me from making this stupid Investment. Its all about the money we earned from the sacrifices we made in our day to day life.
Listen M.chidambaram, Union Minister of Finance is the bhinamidar for “Selene Estate Private Limited” where Indiabulls is constructing Green’s Perumbakkam. And our Minister is a big supporter of DMK party. And No way Hon’ble chief Minister of Tamilnadu – Dr.J.Jayalalitha won’t allow this approval till the end of her reign and positively the next period is also going to Amma’s. So its all going to be a big deadlock for Indiabulls. Since they will make all chances of corruption to get their approval but understand its not possible this time. Since its a war b/w 2 parties. Not between customer and the builder.
Indiabulls Finance sector is one of the well benefite after the 2013 budget and here is the link for your understanding
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/markets/real-estate/realty-trends/budget-2013-a-boost-for-affordable-housing-says-gag
Dear Manish,
Like you, I am also suffering because of their activities. I have booked phase 2 flat during 2010. One good executive Mr. Dhanashekar from IB has resigned. Please add my mail id…baskarg23@gmail.com in your contacts. I am with you for any legal action against IB or in your strong group. I hope, things will change once NAMO will come to power.
Thanks for sharing your experience Baskar. But I have personally not invested in IB , This is just an article published by me
Manish
If this real estate forum is popularised, I am sure most of the builders will think twice before trying to rip off the innocent clients who have no idea about the unfair practices in the real estate market. More and more feedback on standard rates, quality check of materials, brands, prices, qty used will educate the buyers . From A to Z there should be a layman’s guide to deal with the current problems.
Yes..
I happened to visit your site as just yesterday the sales manager of India Bulls Chennai called me for marketing their Perumbakkam flats in Chennai. He was telling me that they have 1000+ flats for sale andonly 40% of them are complete. He wanted us to to be their channel partners as we are consultants in Marketing. As we perceive this case as well as the general trend of the real estate promoters in Chennai seems to be highly deviant. You really don’t get to see one ethically inclined fellow as the culture itself is “greed is Good'” If you go little deep into this apart from agreements, most of them cheat you in quality. Big builders get things done through Diploma holding site engineers who do not care to check what kind of sand or or rod is being used. They are all mainly concerned about cosmetics or the frontage, painting and all those make-up job on the facade to lure the customers. Then why do we market such flats…you may ask.. Valid…we choose..we evaluate.. we do not go near big fellows who would intimidate you by talking you down. When I inquired to the sales manager what kind of sand were they using his instant reply was that”India Bulls” is nationally reputed. Your query here explains it is complete ‘bull’. Why did I mention about sand ….because most of them use sea sand…very bad for the building.
‘
Thanks for sharing this experience with all of us 🙂 . Its quite shocking !
Contact Sri Sri Narendra Modi . Better Contact a Good political Party like BJP, Aaam Aadmi party.
This all types of Corrution is happening because of our wrong Electroal Choice and Lawless land .
Jai Hind
Pretty! This was an extremely wonderful article. Many thanks
for supplying these details.
Welcome
Hi,
I am also an victim Of this project and would like to participate in any actions against this builders.
Can be reached at 91 97414 52862 ( Bangalore no).
Thanks,
Rathnakar
Hi Rathnakar
THanks for putting your contact details, but this is just an article, not a campaign
Hi Manish,
I am interested in joining the group that is sharing the info interms of the progress from the developer. If this is not a place to get that info, then I don’t mind leaving this site.
Sorry for peeping in if this is not a place to get with IB customers group.
Thanks,
Rathnakar.
Please join the group ibgreens-phase1@googlegroups.com, we are nearly 150+ members fighting with them through legal way…
Hi Vinoth,
I am unable to contact you. I tried sending an email, but the group does not exist. Please share if the group id has changed.
Such scenarios are not anytime new to RE world! One has to understand any RE transaction with builder/developer is always in favor of his/her interest. Long story short go for “ready possession/resale” (if you are end user). It’s explicable it will cost high but you see nothing costlier than “peace of mind” spread this word!!!
Yea . I am also a firm believer in that 🙂
I liked your way of thinking and spreading the same. I am proud that Today I learnt something. Hope I dont forget this.
Thanks Ashish
What precautions should be taken before booking an apartment with a builder in Chennai?
ANy experience with Lancor Builders?
You can start a thread on our forum for asking that – http://jagoinvestor.dev.diginnovators.site/forum/
If I remember correctly there was one law proposed/pending in the parliment where the builders have to register themselves to a central authority. If there are any delay by the builder, they have to compensate the customer.
I am not sure what is the status of this law. But someone can give some lights on this matter.
I am not sure of the law, but anyways if a builder delays the delivery, then he has to compensate the customer .
Dear Friend,
I think that the some of the options which can really help are mentioned below, you can take steps accordingly:
1. lodge a complaint with PRESIDENT’S SECRETARIAT HELPLINE on following link :
http://helpline.rb.nic.in/GrievanceNew.aspx
2. you can file a complaint with consumer redressal forum with government of india and add CC to builder.
link is http://www.india.gov.in/outerwin.php?id=http://www.nationalconsumerhelpline.in/ComplaintFile.aspx
3. Register your complaint on http://pgportal.gov.in/Grievance.aspx
4.Register complaints on http://www.grahakseva.com/ which is a website which publishes your complaints online for free and this can be shared on facebook and other social media to get maximum mileage.
5. then you can consult a NGO which is also providing service to consumers on http://grahakjago.com/
6.consult a real estate lawyer like Mr.Vinod Sampat
(http://www.justdial.com/Mumbai/vinod-c-sampat-and-co-%3Cnear%3E-ghatkopar-east/022PK029597_BZDET) or
Mr.Ramesh Prabhu
(A 2/302, Laram Centre, Opposite Railway Station,
Above Federal Bank, Andheri West,
Mumbai – 400058
Phone : +(91)-(22)-26248589, 26248565, 42551414
Mobile : +(91)-9324331579
Both of excellent knowledge on the subject and can guide you very well I suppose.
See to it that all these correspondence which you make should be marked to the HEAD OF DEPARTMENT OF INDIA BULLS and since INDIA BULLS is a registered company it will have information about the Directors and Managing Directors on their website or you can get the same from SEBI and make it a point to send correspondence to them as well.
I think that taking steps mentioned above will surely get you results as i have been able to get justice and my money back in number of cases personally.GOOD LUCK
Thanks for sharing this in so much details !
http://indiabullsgreenschennai.wordpress.com/
Thanks for that link!
Check out this – http://indiabullsgreenschennai.wordpress.com/
Hi All,
*** Thanks to Manish for providing support by publishing this in the main blog***.
Thanks to every who have provided their valuable feedback and their time on reply.
First step from me now is to escalate to higher management (while i am checking the other options suggested above)- how can we escalate to them, right now the contacts we have are only till VP ‘s in IB, who are not really helpful or has any voice in the firm.
Can i expect a suggestion or if any of you know the contact in IB higher management or Someone who can write to IB Higher management on behalf of our cancellation members?
Really Appreciate all your efforts and time on this forum.
Regards,
R.Yakgna Kumar
Thanks !
Hi,
I have seen certain business channels like cnbc awaz,zee business,Bloomber utv, are helping this kind of financial frauds to the concern party and try to get their money back. Many times i found because of their pressure tactics it works in favour of the client. Property guru & Pehredar are one of the shows on cnbc awaz.he show airs on CNBC Awaaz on Saturday afternoons at 3:30pm with repeat telecasts on Saturday evenings at 8pm and Sundays at 1pm and 9pm
But where is the pressure ?
You can write to money life foundation. http://foundation.moneylife.in/contact_us.html
Read the problem of one of the followers of Jagoinvestors.
I am not a lawyer but am in the RE sector. Do consult a lawyer.
First of all, do you have a signed sale agreement (agreement to sell) on stamp paper or not? If not, no agreement exists and refund of booking amount cannot be refused. Sale agreement contains the exact details of the plot size, apartment types and sizes, amenities and all complete details being sold AS PER THE PLAN SANCTION. Reason for Cancellation: Variation between what was promised and what is sought to be delivered.
Next, do you have a plan sanction from the authorities duly approved and given to you at/ before signing of agreement? If not and you have not signed the sale agreement now also, you are safe. Reason: If there is a variation between original promise and the proposed sale agreement, you have a remedy. The 2 year delay is assumed from his side as he needs to prove he has sent you sale agreement long ago and you have delayed.
If there is a variation between the original promise and if you have signed the Sale agreement without checking for the revised plans, you have no remedy. If plan copy was not given, but you still signed agreement, then again you have no remedy.
Your most important document is the Sale Agreement which you should not sign now. In future also you must read through the same and after signing, get it registered.
As far as the Booking amount receipt goes, it is for a specific apartment of a specific size. Bookings can always be cancelled if you do not accept the changes being forced on you. If changes are being made in everything from size, number, carpet area, built up area, super built up area, amenities etc, it is almost a new project and hence you do have a remedy. However insist on performance as per original promise/ agreement and do not initiate cancellation from your end.
Depending upon project cost, the Consumer court (District, State, National) is the correct option. Insist on performance as per original Sale agreement/ Original Promise. If a sale agreement exists with specs different from what is being made now, get that registered before going in for legal remedy. If you do not have one check out with the lawyer whether you can still go to CC. Avoid regular Civil case as they are never time bound.
One thing to be borne in mind is for you to be able to prove delay on the part of the builder in getting plan sanctions, getting plans ready, giving you draft agreement for vetting, intimation of payment of agreement amount and bank clearance of project if it was promised. Insist on interest on booking amount at the rate he would have charged for delayed payment.
If there are any further queries I am can be on 9632266255.
C M Vyas
Thats a great detailed reply . I am glad I am reading this !
Hello
I am not very much familiar with the cancellation procedure, but one thing is sure penalty should not be that high as mentioned ~10% of sale value
Also I suggest to lodge a complaint so others don’t suffer much, although everyone knows how the systems runs.
But I think the paid money can be recovered.
Thanks for sharing what you feel about this case !
This is what I got on mail
I have encountered a problem of somewhat similar nature (with differant facts) for one of my clients and after rigorous follow ups we have come to a suitable solution for my client ….According to me YAKGNA line of action for getting back his booking amount is casual in nature and he is behaving like a naive customer ..This type of situation is a pressure game , The party who can create more pressure on the other from all sides will win the battle . I have in my clients case directly represented the builder and super broker involved in the deal ….I basically being an Advocate have a winning edge in dealing with and representing clients issue ….I think after reading the mail it seems that YAKGNA is trapped in the non performing builders web and Agreements nd booking forms are all non standardized and vary from builder to builder …..The crux is that IB has defaulted and he has to compensate consumer …..If I could know the full facts may be I could guide him the strategy and do written communication on his behalf and could bring him to a better situation ..
Some one sent me this link , might help – http://businesstoday.intoday.in/story/refund-reality-the-hard-way-out/1/8651.html
Hi,
Please check out this article in recent Eco. times – http://articles.economictimes.indiatimes.com/2012-04-09/news/31312910_1_execution-delays-builders-residential-projects. It is a multi page article (6 pages), talks about the delays and the various ways to approach. I think it will give you the information.
ALL it takes is a good lawyer and -ve media publicity to bring down these crooks.
If you are part of group, then –
1) Start off from consumer court, they are much faster
2) Also, consult a good lawyer, approach to him with all the documents. You should file case for breach of contract and mental harassment
3) As a group, try to reach to local new channels, news papers, Make sure builder gets utmost -ve publicity.
Just my two cents….
Thanks for that guidance Samir !
I feel vindicated reading your post. I did not invest in IB greens purely because the agreement is on sided and farcical to the extent that builder also owns common areas in certain cases. I had already checked with a lawyer in chennai with the agreement (or the application form) and he strongly advised me to drop the project. I even influenced my relatives to drop out of the project last year (with minor losses). There are multiple forums discussing the rampant cheating by IB both in panvel and chennai. I believe you know that IB has strong links with Vadra which means considerable political clout.
They had already dropped their phase 3 plans and returned booking amounts to customers. They are in huge cash crunch and are now actively promoting pre-emi waiver options (20-80).
As a corrective action, I recommend you immediately get in touch with a very good real estate lawyer in chennai and see if you can get out with minimal losses. (maybe get in touch with rankassociates who have experts writing for the hindu).
Thanks for those tips Vijay .. I am sure the best thing a customer can do is take preventive measures !
The only option I see is to legally proceeed by a lawyer and fighting as a group or else to proceed in the consumer court. It will take hell lot of time for sure. The judgement you can expect is cout asking them to pay fine and some interest on your amount given. The documents you have signed should have no value if it violates law. Better to start searching for a new house and also parallely fighting for your down payment. Accept reality. I dont think you are going to get your house any time sooner. My personal opinion is IndiaBulls promoters are not trustworthy. Just stay away!!
Thanks for that comment Ravi 🙂 !
I am *not* real estate expert. The following comments may help,
Real estate is on top when it comes to concealing details and non-transparency of money/matters. Many of us fail in valuating the property, mostly end up in buying due to hype :(. In India always practice is different from law. When there is problem only law speaks, not the practice :).
After reading your case I realized there are even worst scenarios (not to discourage you). Some people forfeit their entire down payment or at 10/15% penalty. There are few reputed builders who were unable to finish the construction even after four years.
You can file compliant in CREADAI consumer forum (if they are member of CREADAI). You need strong group to fight. Form your local group legally (requires registration). There was an interesting article on ET Wealth weekly magazine during April 9-15 week. The content may help you to take some actions.
Realty sector is suffering past five years due to various reasons.
Think of a win/win solution prior to an action, and make sure the builder also understands the decision is on mutual benefit. Going to courts, consumer forums consumes time.
Thanks for those comment Venki . I am sure the guy facing issue with look into this !
As you are a group, it is better to approach a real estate lawyer for advise, if not services. He will know the local laws and can clarify the issues for a fees.
Based on this, you may wish to approach consumer court.
Parallelly, the same can be escalated to higher management, as indicated by you. If they are also not responding properly, it will strengthen your case further.
Wish you all the best.
Thanks for that comment Srinivas !